Frage von JoeFX:
What do you think
"Mount Bolex H16 Reflex, including built-in exposure meters (light emitting diode display) fader 40 pictures, in addition angefertigteflache basic compendium with rail, in good general condition, with 3x optical turret c: 495,00 euro
Link: http://www.kinotechnikrinser.de/index2.htm
is wirkich a suitable price for a 16mm film camera, or is this a bit cheated.
Mainly I needed the camera just for the slow motion because it can record up to 64 pictures a second.
Request for opinions know their way around there.
If that is really what I would have to be me no ARRI for 3000 ¬ to create for a few slow-motion clips.
MFG JoeFX
Antwort von nico:
The company rinser is known to me as serous and when I look closer to its total supply, I find that the price is reel for the Bolex H16. One should bear in mind that this format can be found for even less interested than for Super 8
In your place I would buy a good piece with a unique redemption agreement.
Antwort von Schleichmichel:
The offer I have seen synonymous. Your project will be okay. Only if you want this motorized Bolex, you have probably not such a great choice, as with a newer one.
Since I have itself a Bolex, I can help you possibly later emerging problems (such as the exposure, for example) ...
Antwort von Axel:
Had synonymous time a Bolex 16mm, but even with sport hunters. I had an engine can be mounted with me, but I have converted back to spring mechanism, since one usually with such a camera does not make very long shots, and the mechanism is perfectly acceptable, especially for slow motion, where it does not depend on accuracy.
Only comparison: even with the oldest computer, these things very faint, which at high frame rate by the shorter shutter speed is even worse. That would be considered: Satt light!
Antwort von JoeFX:
Thanks for your answers.
I think I'll buy the camera.
Could you write me a small shopping list, so I need to know wasich ncoh? price would be nice.
MFG JoeFX
Antwort von Schleichmichel:
This is s.Deinen requirements (as a mantra), please replace the "your" in "my"! Nevertheless, a few tips:
If your tripod is shaky, and a new just is not in it, I recommend you a cable release. So you can stop motion images synonymous beautiful film (in this case means it really filming:).
An additional meter would be nice. Who knows what to come for banned Batteries in the Beli of the Bolex. I have poured a Profisix of. The runs with standard 9V blocks and can be expanded (spot meter module (not to be confused with telephoto, which is synonymous), color temperature Messer, etc.). Ebay for around 70 ¬.
With a shutter speed of 1 / 240 (this is
not the actual exposure time) at 64fps is a lot of light already attached. When color photography is synonymous at least a gray card is not a bad investment. The colorist will thank you.
It would be important for the present a detailed Camera and Lens Tests with a light reel B & W film Fomapan R100 (rather grainy 100ASA for not frighten). For Wittner, or Fotoimpex (where are you like a change bag s.besten buy), there is the film for not (yet) 22.62 gross.
What sort of slow motion is that?
Antwort von JoeFX:
The slow motion effects are designed for the should harmonize with normal later. Thus, similar to The Matrix Reloaded.
If I understand correctly, the camera has no motor? I would have to purchase an as yet another.
Frankly, I am in terms of roll film a true amateur. Exposure and such things are a little too high (Have so far only with gr x5e and worked a bit with XL2). Is there a website where you will be informed about it or you could explain to me why do I need things like a light meter, since one is already integrated. Certainly this has a reason, but one would have me as a little more Explain.
Apropro: Can I use the camera at all synonymous in general the film shoot? Might be better than class.
MFG JoeFX
Antwort von JoeFX:
Oh yes because of the light!
Since it takes to make you worry!
If the lowlight is as lousy as the x5 (unfortunately very lowlight sex) then that is really not a problem.
Could you maybe send me some pictures of your Bolex? Would be really nice. josef.lichtenberger @ gmx.net
MFG JoeFX ;-)
Antwort von Schleichmichel:
Frankly, I am in terms of roll film a true amateur. Oh, well. Everybody starts off small but work with film cameras to already requires some background on film exposure. Mistakes are immediately noticeable in your wallet.
One is the sheer flood of s.Informationen Page of excellent
Stefan Neudeck
Über Bolex-Kameras gibt es here, hier,
here hier
Für Filmdrehs ist es synonymous wichtig, dass der Viewfinder schwenkbar ist. Bei der Bolex muss man schon manchmal sehr unbequeme Positionen einnehmen. Aber man kann eine Fingerkamera s.den Viewfinder anbringen and bekommt ein flackerfreies Picture geliefert (das ist doch mal Pro ;).
Kontra dagegen ist, dass man nicht wie bei einer SR die Magazine (sofern Magazinbetrieb unterstützt wird) dranpflocken kann and einfach fröhlich losdrehen. Mit einer ST oder BL allerdings synonymous nicht.
Der wichtigste Punkt ist aber, dass die Bolex eine MOS-Camera ist (MotionOnlyShot/MitOhneSound). Sie ist laut.
Der "LOWLIGHT" ist weniger eine Frage der Camera. Abgesehen davon, dass eine federbetriebene Bolex eine Sektorenblende of 135° Öffnung hat and das Strahlenteilerprisma 25% des Lichtes für den Viewfinder abzwackt, ist es nicht die Camera with den Helligkeitseigenschaften, sondern Filmmaterial and Lens.
Mit einer Arriflex 16ST kommt man auf Belichtungszeiten of 1/48 bei 24Bilden pro Sekunde UND man hat Standart- oder Arri-Bajonettmounts. Die Bildfrequenz kann man with dieser Camera with entspr. Motor auf 100Bilder pro Sekunde hochjagen. Allerdings ist es dann with Super16 vorbei. Da bist Du with einer Bolex besser dran.
Motoren gibt es für die Bolex of
hier,
Tobin, or for the particularly large purses synonymous of Bolex itself. And since not even with quartz.
With an external light meter you're flexible. And in the winter holidays on the secure page;) (internal Beli the snow measured as 18% neutral gray, and the dull film afterwards None of your wants) to see well-known. Furthermore, the internal Beli could go only up to 400 ASA. Since, however, without further ado, thanks to the improved film materials safely synonymous times for 500 attacks ...
Incidentally, there is
Antwort von Axel:
"Bad" button, the debut of Peter Jackson, was with a Bolex on 16mm and later dubbed as a silent film rotated and blown up to 35mm. The film there are up for grabs, or in a well-stocked video stores in the splatter department. He shows that synonymous with no professional equipment "Movies" can be made.
My view as an ex-user, moderately talented image-maker and fan of
contents: The camera would be the best training device to meet the reference to all the parameters of the film recording technology. As a mechanical device with limited recording time and a real silent movie camera, it forces you to think on film.
This thinking may come as a DV or HDV filmmakers one only benefit. With the difference that the digital images are cheaper and more convenient to handle. Only in rare cases will be 16mm, the output format ...
I gave my camera a friendly photographer, who comes to art. It is developing the film yourself if you hundreds of feet of film on her washing line and then see the beautifully photographed images on the screen is easy to see how deep the divide between real film and digital imprints really is. And how despicable the anxious question of the "Resolution". She photographed with professional digital cameras for 50,000 ¬ in parallel with series of pictures with Polaroid.
As a compromise, this camera is not good. Most computer users would be in this forum it only poorly exposed to coax blurred shots. And be disappointed.
Was hoped that a decision-making.
Antwort von Schleichmichel:
As a compromise, this camera is not good. Most computer users would be in this forum it only poorly exposed to coax blurred shots. And be disappointed. An important and good synonymous disappointment, I think. Finally resolved so that even a self-deception. Those who want it a try with film ... once you borrow a movie camera (etc.) and tried it. Look at it as a challenge.
Good shout, Axel!
Antwort von JoeFX:
Again, thank you for your answers ...
So if I have misunderstood you, you want to dissuade me of this camera?
The rotation with the film was just a question. Depth of Field ...
Which camera would you say to me the other (still recommend the film shoot is understood ..)? Arriflex?
I've heard that it is possible to rebuild ne Bolex reflex in Super16. Would certainly be expensive. or?
For slow motion then adjusts the Bolex. Then I'll buy, unless you know ne better to nem not too much difference in price.
MFG JoeFX
Antwort von Schleichmichel:
What advise (I know what words mean advise, you know sure), so I did not mean that ...
If you still little experience with exposure of film you made, I advise you, so you employ erstmal in Stillfotografie too. If you then hinbekommst flawless negatives without any automatic function and you with the weiterverarbeitung of footage have explained, you will certainly save you a lot of trouble.
If it with the film shoot hurry, you should add a / s cameraman / woman for the camera work (and still like to organize a wizard) and where the equipment selection (mostly left). Whether there should be an Arri, Aaton Bolex or even, it follows from the particular requirements of the production.
The conversion of a Bolex with bayonet on S16 will cost £ 500 in Wales at www.lesbosher.co.uk including service.
Remember that 64 frames per second is not incredibly slow motion. Test it s.besten with a video sequence, how slow it was.
Rent it first time a camera. Take a camera course.
For example here: www.koelner-filmhaus.de synonymous or where ever you live ...
Antwort von WinAntivirus_009:
Do you have the time had actually considered synonymous, the Prices for the footage?
11 minutes cost approx 340th - Euro including development and if you then films in slow motion 64 fps with 4 minutes will cost so much.
Pretty expensive pared to a mini-DV tape with 3 - Euro per hour.
Antwort von PowerMac:
I do not recommend synonymous. In itself it is not so difficult to work with film ... If five years of experience with film and camera feel has! Everything else is murks and expensive. So I recommend a camera synonymous rate (retro-film wave) or a camera study. As you do this thoroughly;)
Antwort von Schleichmichel:
Pretty expensive pared to a mini-DV tape with 3 - Euro per hour. Especially since you can dub MiniDV synonymous again. AND sound is with this! And in the computer you can simply (or not synonymous when one looks at the forum to dub). In addition, MiniDV tapes can be bought anywhere and look at the pictures now ... even on the television, when it connects to the camcorder. Also, the camcorder is in Comparison totally cheap. Even such a olle A-Minima costs around 14000 ¬ and the Lenses again cost the same.
No, in earnest, Anonymous. I hope you realize yourself that because something does not fit with the Comparison.
The key word is "production requirements. There are projects for which a video camera would be idiotic AND there are projects for which a film equipment would be a very nice block oversized s.Bein and completely.
Antwort von prem:
Sure lags the Comparison. Good photographers and filmmakers working today synonymous with silver material and not with the Mist of digital cameras and in particular in the middle and large size.
Antwort von JoeFX:
How do I see the question to make a complete film in order to have been taken too seriously ...
I am not concerned about turning to a blockbuster. I just needed a good camera, with which one can turn slow motion.
When I think about it, then all this to me a bit too expensive with the Bolex ...
Could you suggest to me maybe a better camera, the slow motion is the ability to record more than 60 pictures?
This time, please Super8 ...
EBay gibts die ja so cheap ...
Would ask for prompt reply.
MFG JoeFX
PS: @ guest: a 360 meters of Kodak 35mm film roll cost 610 ¬. Small confusion I guess.
Antwort von Schleichmichel:
At 16mm, the suits already with the 340 ¬ for a 122m reel. And so it went, I think ...
For a slow motion but would submit a 30.5 m coil.
A 6008 Beaulieu comes to 56B/sek. But everything has its price, the synonymous. And I doubt that is the steadiness with such speed Super8 still acceptable.
Antwort von JoeFX:
So I think the time is no big difference between the Bolex and will be 6008 ... High shutter time = darkness
Beaulieu 6008 I've already thought synonymous. If there is no counter-proposals, they are a logical choice.
Thanks Schleich Michel!
MFG JoeFX
Antwort von JoeFX:
No objections?
Why the purchase?
Antwort von Schleichmichel:
So I think the time is no big difference between the Bolex and will be 6008 ... High shutter time = darkness But between Super 8 and 16mm quite a bold difference is that you are hopefully aware of. slow motion or not ... but since 16mm has a better price / performance ratio. Super8 is indeed not synonymous SOOO cheap!
Foot at me afterwards, if you do not like the quality.
Antwort von domain:
Yes, the times is true in any case. 8mm is not look like much.
But there is something to consider, 56 fps is absolutely not a great slow motion, is only slightly less than half the normal speed.
Similar effects can be achieved in good synonymous NLE systems, when the 25 fps interpolated by genuine, ie intermediate calculated as at 50 may be doubled.
LG domain
Antwort von Schleichmichel:
Then you hear it, Joe. So a really good slow motion you will only hinbekommen an Arriflex SR with high speed. That is only synonymous rent in question. How often do you need synonymous 150 frames per second?
Antwort von JoeFX:
From grumbling will be no question ...
Mir gehts halt only on the nerves of the double at a slow motion, the PAL material gets only half the quality.
Moreover, I find the material for 16mm sauteuer wenns really are 340 ¬.
I just wanted to find a way to express myself with lousy slow motion.
Super8 since Resolutionhat more than nurhalbes PAL, I find it quite acceptable.
I thought when I double slow motion with Motion Perfect may again stoking one Schäufchen ...
What do you think?
MFg JoeFX
Antwort von Schleichmichel:
Super8 since Resolutionhat more than nurhalbes PAL, I find it quite acceptable. As times someone has identified drummed for his dear, old Super8 little too strong. In general, the Resolutionvon not quite so bad S8, as is sometimes claimed. But it requires a bit of experience (not just a lot of light and right) sharpen the picture to get a similar crisp as video.
Do not misjudge. I again emphasize SUPER8 ALSO IS NOT CHEAP, and if one looks at the quality afterwards ... try it out before my dear. Locking yourself with Super8 forums shortly. Maybe you can send a video file because someone, so you see what you expected.
Now towards the end of this thread, I advise you not to purchase, but tests. For between the lines it reads out a certain amount of ignorance when it comes to dealing with film material.
Not rush!
Antwort von JoeFX:
Thank you.
Where could I s.Besten information on Super 8?
(The last question ;-)) is
MFG JoeFX
Antwort von Cutaway:
Hello,
Here is an address:
www.german.film-super8.de. There is also in the film club of the Federation of German film BDFA some authors to film with Super 8, www.bdfa.de.
Good luck wishes Cutaway
Thank you.
Where could I s.Besten information on Super 8?
(The last question ;-)) is
MFG JoeFX
Antwort von domain:
Well this last question is fully acceptable, although they would not really make connoisseurs.
Even with the best S8 -> DV converters is the result of rather thin.
But you've somehow the spleen in the head with the super slow motion. And when times are lying almost next to useless if you wanted to use the classic film footage of this.
If anything, the only CMOS could solve your problem special cameras (they're doing synonymous 1000 fps and more)
LG domain
