Frage von ennui:
Hello,
I do not understand completely: HD and SD component signal are two completely different things? Or similar, but not compatible with each other? When I s.einen Pal monitor with component input signal with an HD signal there comp, then what happens? And since you can somehow out-herkonvertieren and?
Antwort von ennui:
Or in other words: Which HD signal can be herunterkonvertieren how to get an SD preview of it?
Antwort von WoWu:
@ Ennui
They are two different pairs of shoes ...
HD has a completely different resolution than SD ... You probably come of 1920x1080 and want to go to 720x576 respectively. If you have an analog TV device, according to 768x576.
For HD, we have Pixelraten of 148 MHz (; 1080p) and SD at only 13.5 MHz
To get down That You either have to convert in the camera, "or on your graphics card, or other hardware to" on fly "an SD preview.
Afterwards, you can then, depending on, so expect your source of RGB to Y `CbCr or if it should be analogous to YUV, or, if necessary, transferred to composite, depending on what awaits your monitor.
Antwort von ennui:
Thanks for the explanation. "Component signal" now appears at times on both SD as synonymous with HD, see Male (; well? From the same color), and I find it all a bit confusing. So there is less "component HD" and "component-SD", one says simply component signal to both.
I wonder all this is because I had, after all simple, in the future when HD editing in Edius like just a runterskalierte HD to SD Preview on a Pal-tube monitor. As with DV editing.
Now, is there NLE editing cards (; for PC) that can output HDMI, or those with component breakout box (; HD Storm / Spark, etc.). In one variation of the components might think because you can easily monitor the Pal ranhängen that would runterskalieren it yourself: which is not so. How else would it be to make: Are there any converters, and if so, what, take the s.HD? The HD component or HDMI or even the HD-SDI?
I read somewhere here synonymous of Black Magic (;?)- cards, etc., where sowas goes well, but have other problems, and are more likely to Premiere (;?). But I would actually like to work with Edius. So far I have only the monitor, Pal, (with components; SD?)-Input and very good resolution (; tube). CVBS and Y / C gibts course, synonymous.
Edius preview - Pal-tube monitor. Any elegant solution?
Antwort von ennui:
Thus, the result of my research: The HD Storm Plus is probably out via SD Erweiterungsbay itself as composite, S-Video and component signal for Pal monitors.
Gibts then a difference between component and S-video quality? Ought to be visible.
And HDMI to Component / YUV converter, then to HD Component (;?), as you would need it for older hardware HD, which has no HDCP / HDMI, such as tubes or old professional HD projector, gabs probably quite times but are now banned because they could remove the HDCP copy protection. Thus, only the expensive route via HD-SDI remains, if any, support, or the use of an HDMI-to-VGA converter, VGA if somehow fits the gibts still synonymous.
So my search has ended, and the impression remains that HD-cut either with a lot of money is a good chance in the professional segment, or via HDMI on LCDs in several variants, such as HD Spark -> LCD TV. LCD monitors that are not worth what really are and are highly comparable with tubes, probably priceless, and what is affordable, not so sure.
I probably stay until at times runterskalierter Pal preview and DVD as the end product, as a lot more common. And now, a lot of money for (and often immature, poor pay) HDMI hardware such as Blue-ray burner or player s.eine industry that comes with HDCP proscriptive me then, and wants to ban me about HDMI -> YUV, for I am not in question.
Thanks again for all the tips.
Antwort von WoWu:
@ Ennui
Your feature is that you scaled down (for the cut, as I have understood), while the HD signal to SD to look like a tube TV.
This is the feature that makes it so expensive, but not HD editing, because even for relatively little money, there are monitors that can display HD and are synonymous of high quality interfaces.
Instead of such hardware scaling, then s.dem synonymous still have to match the interfaces (; and from SDI is again expensive), would I stand for a cheap monitor and reflect again on the 4:3 representation of the editing.
Scaling the whole thing later in the NLE and look down on it then the tube TV ... This is the least expensive solution.
Antwort von ennui:
@ Wowu
Yes, more precisely, ni8cht on a TV, but to an NTSC / Pal-tube-video monitor with 750 lines (; the favorable of JVC). Has as inputs: CVBS, S-video (; slightly better), and (, SD) components. And I am / was currently thinking, as I was an HD preview runterskaliert on SD raufkriege. To continue working the way I'm used to SD, but of course in the best possible quality in terms of sharpness, color, etc. In a tube. At the moment I cut it SD only, with Y / C output to the monitor. HD equipment I have garnix, quasi-plane just before, what I'll do what fits together like. For me, it works with component or HDMI is so far only just theory, I try to understand the technology. HD would be interesting for me because of higher resolution for projections, higher (;?) Dynamic range, film nearby. But all that please at the level of mature MiniDV. There are currently no gehts synonymous.
The original plan (, HD-tube monitor, which is controlled by analog HD component signal of the capture card or converter is), I have already given up: Very expensive, is to monitor the size of the difference for the invented good SD / HD may not be so dramatic; the HD monitor is discontinued model, and desired input options are hardly available, HDMI - YUV converter as HDMI connection interface card - HD component input but gabs mal, but are now banned well, HD-SDI will cost a fortune again and again is a bit exaggerated for me.
I imagine that (my current planning, Pal 15 "monitor, faster pc, Edius + HD Plus Storm Bay with (, SD) component that allows preview synonymous SD), subjective quality would not be much worse . The HD resolution of course is not quite as on the application, color corrections can not be seen at finer structures. But on the PC monitor so I can judge the severity separately, and high-end are my rights again not synonymous. Above all, I want to keep working erstmal SD, and so is optimal.
Remains only the question of how the new calculator because it can capture MiniDV whether the HD-Storm with a firewire card is compatible, whether it is available with Edius. For that I will continue, as I said.
Camera choice for HD is synonymous not yet been adopted, have the impression that there continues to be better still waits. Anything between GH-1 (; AVCHD sucks, 1 CMOS instead of 3 CCD color affected me a little weak, otherwise interesting) or AG-HPX171E (; 3CCD instead of CMOS, DVCPRO P2HD, but only 1 / 3 inch CCDs as the DVX100 , beautiful colors, but little blurred? expensive, "souped-DVX100") and Red Scarlet (; nails with heads, cheap, 2/3-Chip, but only one and CMOS?, future of music, until the autumn, exotic codec, 2K, 3K-resolution previously only available on Mac Cutable? () or one of the good Consumercams, what are they? AVCHD ...). With the Wait there is more likely to be on the safe Page, HD does not run (one of them yes, except for CRT displays, unfortunately), and fall in doubt, get the Prices, and new things.
I did so a bit of the feeling, and it intensifies the longer I was researching, so that MiniDV was a workplace accident. Intended as a consumer format, it was a quantum leap of Hi8 or VHS, and is so far compressed that one super and professionally to work with. Since it is difficult, however, convey to the broadcast / professional segment, why are they so much money to spend more. They put it in the larger chip sizes and improved color subsampling for the semi / professional segment, but what the actual quality, etc. was concerned, it was not soo different. The last MiniDV Cams indeed synonymous demonstratively walked back towards "consumer" / Automatic / Useless features.
When you cut HD now has almost straightened the situation again: AVCHD for consumer who want to anyway so not only their images s.HD LCD
Antwort von ennui:
But only again to understand for me:
There are SD digital (, MiniDV, DVCPRO, SDI and SD analog mpeg2 ,...) (; CVBS, S-Video, component, ie YUV SD?)
There are HD digital (, HD-SDI, HDMI, RGB?, Y `CbCr?, (, X) VGA?) And HD analog (; component, ie synonymous YUV, but as HD?)?
Is that so? Question mark where I am a little unsure if I understood correctly.
Has anyone else may have a link to an overview and Comparison of different HD / SD format? Or examples, such as who / where, for example YUV to SD used for what and how much difference it really makes?
Thank you ...
Antwort von WoWu:
Hello ennui
... I see you do you really think about the issue, but some things are still confused.
There are SD digital (, MiniDV, DVCPRO, SDI and SD analog mpeg2 ,...) (; CVBS, S-Video, component, ie YUV SD?) There was now in "every village a dog" in it, MiniDV is a tape format, DVCPro a codec, a hardware interface, SDI, YUV color format is one, in this case for an analog format. In the digital world this is YCbCr as before and a codec mpeg2, but can be a synonymous bitstream.
But that SD is not limited to, any other combinations are also possible.
There are HD digital (, HD-SDI, HDMI, RGB?, Y `CbCr?, (, X) VGA?) And HD analog (; component, ie synonymous YUV, but as HD?)? The same is true for the HD bundle of papers to ... Incidentally not synonymous HDMI HD is limited, but transmits synonymous SD signals. HDMI is like (SDI, HDSDI), only one hardware interface.
My advice, look into my book, there are all these connections ... And still more wiel said. Be interesting for me ... I recommend the download ...
As for your camera reflections, so I tend to 3-chip solutions and do not really understand why the CMS so demonized. The advantages of CMOS and significantly outweigh the little bit of many companies, RS is already compensated by a higher readout rate. That may be because synonymous, but that we make for the content that we create, no Reßschwenks, but HD customized camera movements. Incidentally Reßschwenks synonymous with CCDs see modest, because other effects weigh at least as difficult.
This would therefore not RS perse a disadvantage, you have Sodern the mode of action in their own hands.
And what AVC (; Hd) concerns .... after all, was synonymous MPEG2 format, and no acquisition of any work with it. Happens to be the advanced AVC/H.264 format, and the tale of the oversized calculator, have the synonymous disseminated only those who did not know any better resolves itself synonymous gradually turned into hot on air.
With the Wait so this is such a thing, because in future it will be more rather than less AVC format type in the cameras.
Antwort von ennui:
There is certainly some confusion still running. I just wanted to enumerate the various formats, codecs and standards, in which a video today unterkommt so fit and especially the component signal SD / HD because somehow. So I think this just s.interessantesten because qualitatively quite near s.SDI / HDMI, but at the same analogy, cheap, common. Anyway, I've now found a way to possibly look at my future preview.
To CMOS: Because synonymous prejudices certainly play a role, once the poor were indeed the cheap alternative to CCDs in cell phones and Billigcams. Meanwhile, they do seem to have a lot to do, and are probably synonymous benefits-noise and are probably cheaper in production, etc.
But now that a camera that makes any specify how or what to shoot you (and there is not a current of Panasonic, which warns happy times "they have swung too fast"?), So technically (; even more than before) Influence the film / video takes shape, is unacceptable to me. The thing is a tool with which I will implement what comes to mind, not the other way. A little light - bad picture is clear, but that now things will not go (; is Reißschwenks), went so far, yes really a regression. But this fits quite well with Consumercams to recognize that now faces, removing blemishes, take up only smiling people, or all modes such as "sports, candlelight, sunset, wedding, baby macro cute", etc. Sorry, I will also capture other things. And if it should happen for some reason that I even want to have a fast moving image background, films from the wild train, or to film trees in the wind or a stream, or anything else, what makes it the codec or the sensor to the madness, because the developers did not accept, want something crazy that someone would shoot, then this is for me only once useless technology and no progress. What comes next, cameras turn off, if the face does not recognize people or sunsets in the Picture? And then comes a message: "Warning found no motive in the Picture"?
And that for video codecs / compression methods such as Mini DV or Motion JPEG, or other more conservative intra-frame method are better than all these GOP mpeg stories that one because the incision then louder einhandelt problems is synonymous to me as a relative layman clear. Live I've seen it already synonymous. Therefore, the more professional codecs handle it so as synonymous. To represent the people AVCHD and say, "Great, because you can now watch HD and film, but unfortunately it is so compressed that there is now her newest quad + Calculator product if it is now but wanted to cut time, while looking forward to the PC-commerce, but not me. The only advantage is that the reduced rate. Mp3 zb. synonymous sounds great, but no one would accept as sound material 128b/s-Mp3 of his sound man. Even the Consumercams have since 48khz PCM - at least so far. And memory and high data rates are always cheaper. If we indeed synonymous everything s.der Red Camera: sowas wholly consistent. The major Manufacturers should rather be times when a similarly innovative, rather than emphasizing always make the same models easily geupgraded new, and what is technically possible, instead of listening to the marketing departments, which do not need or want, or the customers claimed. Or "HD-Ready". What am I happy with my old Panasonic TV. Since then all have been brought to the World Cup, these new "HD" TVs, and then I was silent always polite - but the (; scaled-Pal) Picture looked grottig, dark, dull, muddy. Now there better, and all are angry.
before you really had the feeling that there simply is progress in technology, and things got better. For some time it will only cheaper, but quality has stagnated, or even go back again. Windows Vista, AVCHD, HD-Ready, DVB-T with the lousy data rates ... 1/8-CCDs ... Megapixel giant w
Antwort von WoWu:
@ Ennui
In many parts, I agree with you completely, but it is not all quite so bad in the new technology ... There are synonymous progress, but we can not just enter into any traps, which interprets the industry for consumers and we must not fall for every lousy slogan and not hold any shiny gold stickers for a quality criterion.
The industry and consumers of disappointed lives of a large part in the trade press synonymous disseminated only colored, of marketing and PR people pre-filtered information. Therefore, it is so important to get her own independent and on Picture to expand your horizons and look to the true sense of proportion: Strenuous, but possible.
But I see that you are there on the right track.
