Infoseite // Camcorders Project Design / Interface Design "quick questions"

Frage von jonas_id:


edited

hello dear Slash Cam Forum

I need your help in the following topic:
I am a industrial design student s.der University of Wuppertal and edit this semester, the topic of product complexity with Focus consumer camcorder. Ie a Camorder redesign including development of new operating concepts. The handling is, in my opinion, the camcorder is absolutely essential to good pictures to come. And I think many of you have ever made on operating structures s.Camcorders swear.
I myself have a little experience with camcorders, but I need your experience to synonymous my horizons to expand a little!
Important for me, the camcorder is a consumer device. The wide price range which is interesting for me is about 350-1600 ¬ (Obergerenze camcorder like SonyHDR-SR1E).

As a first time basis is important for me to know:
(Replies simply according to the scheme 1bcd; 2a; 3AC, etc. - do not need a lot of time :-))

1. What your take on? Or, if your camcorder you a want to buy what do you want to include?
s.Geburtstage
b. Family Celebrations
c. Weddings
d. sports such as snowboarding, skateboarding
e. Holidays
f. own shorts
g. Documentation
h. Documentation Project (University School, job)
i. other (designation would be super)

2. Use your automatic mode?
s.ja
b. no

3. Which manual functions are important for you?
s.manueller Focus
b. manual aperture setting
c. Manual White Balance
d. Display Calibration
e. other (possibly named)

4. Still uses the image of your function?
s.ja
b. no

5. Use your editing of filmed material? (Title for tape or clip-in camcorder to enter if no why not? Too cumbersome?)
s.ja
b. no

6. What kind of camera you use?

That would be my questions for the first step. About your answer would be I am very happy! Suggestions synonymous But what I have in any case should take into consideration are always welcome! Me is no statistical importance, I am only in search of good suggestions.

Also, the opinions of advanced you are with prosumer camcorders such as Canon XL-H1 or SonyHDR-FX1 employ are interesting, because your probably a sharp eye to do what the consumer camcorders is amiss!

Of course I will try out over the course of the project to keep.
So thank you in advance schonmal
Greetings Jonas



Antwort von Axel:

Is there actually a strategy of the industry, the average s.Calculator very unattractive for consumers to make?
In my favorite writer-dealer image, where even a month ago the Pana NV-GS500EG the SonyFX7 and eye-catching as the Canon XL-H1 in the window stood, only small hard disks or DVD-Cams in SD or HD resolution to not just low prices. I'm trying to wade into the needs of a filmmaker reinzudenken family, and can understand that things are as compact offering.
Other hand, there are always more requests here in the forum, what with people now start their material. The seller in the store of purchase are unlikely to advise against, but what the manufacturer promises that? Is that intentional? Is not as if you have a UMTS mobile phone with photo function and Mp3 player offering, with which one can not make calls ...



Antwort von jonas_id:

I think that the companies little thought about how the real camcorder are used. In addition, under the ever-shorter product cycles, the poor vote. The camcorder industry has supported the development of HDD and SD without pushed to the left and right to look, and creates a lack of bim Purchase in the business have not noticed, but rather as an advantage, therefore, is: "Wow so small" - this is obviously a very short thought because once you get frustrated buyers are not as fast back! I think when a consumer camcorder should naturally super easy entry ensures "PointandShoot" abe synonymous with the opportunity to enter a little deeper if you want a bit more with the issue has!

My Project is on the state in 3-5 years. And I go, however, that by that time a tapeless HD Stansard enforced, the synonymous with the cutting programs compatible. Or what do you think? Could that be AVCHD?



Antwort von Axel:

Tomorrow Jonas,
I wanted you just suggest that your questions in a questionnaire pack, otherwise the gray Slashcam before many Tipperei to all the questions formulated to answer.



Antwort von jonas_id:

hi axel,
do you as an attachment (word or similar) or the function to add poll? Can I have more than one question? or more in Sti what your filming? s.Geburtstage
b. Sports
c shorts, etc. ..

Greetings Jonas



Antwort von Axel:

Enter an e-mail address, then yes you can be a completed Word.doc Attachment subscription. To view the attachment to see, of course you must be registered, so fall visitors, Streuner lost from the grid. If this is your skewed statistics, but do it with a, b, c, so that with yes, no reply.



Antwort von jonas_id:

hab mal edited the questions, hope it brings some s.ein answer. axel danke für den Hinweis!



Antwort von Jochen Krivat:

OK, I'll begin to:
1EH
2a
3b
4b
5b

So I am more of a hobby user :-)

Jochen



Antwort von Axel:

1: c, d, e, f, g, i (experimental)
2: a (sometimes), b
3: a, b, c, d, e (Tonaussteuerung)
4: b
5: b (habit)
6: VX 1000, VX 2000, DVX 100, FX1






Antwort von alexcy:

1. fg
2. both
3. abc
4. no
5. because I do not need
6. SonyHC40E

LG
Peter



Antwort von PowerMac:

1. f, g, i (especially on television broadcasts in the Private Music)
2. b
3. sb, c, d, e (Shutter, knee, black stretch, gamma curve, etc.)
4. b
5. b
6. DSR390, Z1, DVX100A, HVX200

Suggestions: Fummel scheisse buttons are large gutgebaute buttons you need. The more spontaneous it rotates, such as EB, the more you need big, strong operating functions. Say good focus rings, trim rings. With scenic shooting most of it has more time, which forgives mistakes. Good: auto. Focus Shifts to keypress. Good: Large, high resolution displays, good focus, solid finish



Antwort von Jan:

1. d, i (Concert, Music Video, Interview)
2. b, a (rare)
3. a, b, c, e shutter - the famous 1 / 50 sec, and manual gain Tonaussteuerung at FX 7 Expanded Focus and Peaking
4. b
5. b - I write the data on the shooting rather on the cassette label.
6. Panasonic GS 500, SonyHDR FX 7 & DSR PD 170

AVCHD is to my mind is already enforced, but in the consumer market. Also because the largest firms in the industry are supporting it, software companies are synonymous yet to come.

VG
Jan



Antwort von Johannes:

Hello
1: a, b, c, d, e, f, h
2: a
3: a, b, e Tonausteuerung, zoom
4: b
5: b
6: Canon XM1

Greeting: John

ps: Image Stabilization think I would still quite good



Antwort von jonas_id:

Hello
thank you for the answers!

@ Jochen - Does your camcorder have an extra wheel for the aperture setting? With + / - such as Sony camcorder with an indication of the aperture value (F2.0) or similar)
What did you do for a camcorder? (Had the question because, unfortunately, not yet with inside)

@ Axel - What's in your Tonaussteuerung important? Volume level?

@ Peter - you use the spot-focus function? Have not yet camcorder in the hands and had it actually sounds like a good feature!

Powermac @ - This is already quite advanced! Had after the first and Black Stretch Knee google :-). I previously had no notion. I think a manual setting of knee and Black Stretch in the consumer area is probably a little too much, but do you know whether the consumer camcorder, this subject is already in your applications? Could in low light conditions might be possible?
- The notice with the buttons, I think is exactly right -> but sauschwer observed ... The miniaturization in the consumer camcorder is the field I do not reside. When I look at the Panasonic SDR-S150 anschauen - -> s.die screwed into the tripod thread is still purely a pin so that you can keep! But that's my point at the moment, I am about how the equipment despite little space yet holds operated and not only the automatic mode is available ...

@ Jan - What you mainly use the GS500? Is for me very interesting, since it is a consumer camcorder with fairly good manual setting is ...

@ John - What are the functions you use when Tonaussteuerung?

So again many thanks to you all! Hope for more great suggestions.



Antwort von PowerMac:

I think we must move with the Minitarisierung of camcorders of previous operating concepts separate. Traditional keys are too small and no longer operable. Looking at such a device but s.and dissolves thinking of what the functions are there and rejects the logic of the alleged Bedienelemtente arrangement, you can see quite a lot of space! Those things are almost always less than ten cm long. Then you could have the entire length of the device include a focus control. Ten cm long, one way and her pushing Elemement equivalent or similar to a fader in a mixer. Front row, means a focus far away, the button to the back pulled a close focus. In these faders, one could still rasterized wheel (similar to a mouse scroll wheel) in, with the brightness is generally governs. Brightness = (shutter, aperture, gain) is calculated by the computer. Idealerwese Aperture or Shutter priority.



Antwort von jonas_id:

Powermac Hey ... is exactly that in the Project. when I am in such a mini-camcorder front focus ring mounting, is probably synonymous never helped, because the more None may. Your idea with the slider is designed exactly in the right direction! One old structures can not exceed 1 to 1 on the new dimensions apply. Perhaps it is synonymous two clean running wheels turning s.zeigefinger for Aperture and Focus to ...

It is important in my Project synonymous especially the absolute beginner the fun s.filmen discover and, where appropriate, with the device can be developed. (Modularity or similar)
Even beginners find it so very difficult now with the handling. One thousand controls that you need not initially, but later should be interesting ... The goal is in the consumer area is always the product itself explains what (almost) can not be reached .. because who wants a book of manual reading ...
- It would be interesting to synonymous experiences of newcomers to hear that with your new camcorder apart without manual set. Or synonymous with manual - They are not always synonymous easy to understand!



Antwort von Jan:

The GS 500 is for me simply the best camera around halfway good recordings - interviews & concert recordings to make.

We have only because they used a very small budget, if not more money there. PD 170 & FX 7 are given an entirely different class.

The GS 500 has at least the functions of equipment & the most important features: manual / r shutter, aperture or gain, focus ring and manual Tonaussteuerung very important.

When did you stop concert 2 variants. Either you take a small recorder directly from the sound mixer or directly into the microphone input / Line In / XLR input of the camera.

We therefore take the sound directly from the console into the camera, because it is firstly Lippensyncron. For an inexperienced cutter, it is damn hard to sound really Lippensyncron later for the whole concert on it to lay.

There are so like the local channels from my town - * TV, where the evening shots are played with sound presented - sometimes cruel despite Digibeta Camera.

And secondly, if the sound level from the console is too high, the small recorder completely distorted it again - which usually have no audio control s.Gerät.

Therefore the sound into the camera myself levels, with Headphones - Closed s.Besten - GS 500 has no headphone jack - it is terrible to hear if there distortions or the input level from the console is too high, and together with the Tonchef vote.

VG
Jan



Antwort von Axel:

"jonas_id" wrote: @ Axel - What's in your Tonaussteuerung important? Volume level?

Exactly. I started as assistant EB started at a time when it was normal, a recorder mitzuschleppen. I controlled the sound through Headphones and after the meter. It was still analog, and clipping do not immediately make the sound unusable. The automatic transmission failed in the disco, but is synonymous silent Atmo better gepegelt of hand. Whether the automatic anbleibt depends thus of the recording situation.






Antwort von Bamboo:

Hello.

I am a media researcher must grumble because times s.der method of data collection ... :-)

Would it not be better than an online questionnaire to create, by the one in 5 min can browse?! I think the approach here is very beautiful - the idea for discussion will certainly help you! But for representative data, a questionnaire would be more appropriate, right?
The willingness to would certainly be available.

Nevertheless:

1. b) e) f) g) i) (eg, theatrical performances, concerts, etc.)
2. a) (synonymous if very rare)
3. sb) c) e) (Shutter, Tonaussteuerung)
4, b)
5. b) (kA! I previously thought not necessary! Tapes are labeled
and the material in designated logging)
6. SonyFX-1, Canon XL-1, Panasonic NV-GS-70, SonyVX 2000

Gruss
Michel



Antwort von jonas_id:

Thanks Axel, Jan and Michael for the additional explanation!
@ Michael, with the data you have already learned quite right. I am here but really more a matter of good ideas to get people of the intensively with the topic, this is this free form is very good.
After my last intermediate correction, the Project is now on a strong consumer camcorder the size of Panasonic SDR-S150's. This is now the difficulty of the clear delineation of camcorder phones like the Nokia N93 to create. If that is possible?
Furthermore, I am still interested in the matter of whether someone schonmal the Spot Focus feature of SonyCams has ever used?



Antwort von Jan:

At least in the video comes as no mobile phone with the S 150 with SDR (low data rate, lower resolution, piepsiger Sound Wave etc).

The phones are always better, a new Sonyhat example of a 1 / 2, 8 "CCD (SDR S 150 3x 1 / 6") - to be found in a rare video, the little light still weak lenses provide for not more for mobile phones is possible.

Focus Point - yes Sonyhatt always nice ideas about the life of automatic film yet simple to make. Few people want to use But - rather in the Easy mode. Although like with a click on the touch screen the distance of the desired object, the Camera ansich show is not bad.

Question - I film in the consumer area with Panasonic, Semi Pro and Sony have models of such functions are not - not synonymous touchscreen - thank God!

VG
Jan



Antwort von jonas_id:

Hi Jan, thank you for your answer.
The touchscreen control surface as a solution seems to me in the form in which it is synonymous with Sonyvorliegt not particularly useful. Since the display in my assumption in the consumer sector is being used more frequently than the viewfinders, disrupt the very fingerprints. Only the Spot Focus feature seems interesting, but obviously has the same problem.

Someone knows if there is a camcorder, a ventral Optics has? (Analogous to compact digital cameras) - Do I have until now still can not find. I think the real problem is that a long time been the engine makes too much noise, but there are models that work very quietly. Another problem is probably synonymous nor the low optical zoom range, the majority only goes up to 4x. My idea is this, however, but synonymous, when the camcorders zoom is often only a marketing tool is ... I think a big optical zoom of 10-20x more effectively leads to more blurred images, as he uses.
or draw a lot of you, or even their optical digital zoom off?
Greetings Jonas



Antwort von Stöpsel:

1. Question:
I nem with anything on my camcorder of of s.Geburtstage-i) Own Films.
2. Question:
I use the automatic mode only if I'm in hurry (something quickly before the lens needs). If I get more time I've nem the manual mode.
3. Question:
The most important thing for me is the focus ring, which, unfortunately, in my NVGS 180 of Panasonic missing. Otherwise, for me, the white balance is very important.
4.Frage:
I use the Photo function reluctant because the pictures are too bad. My opinion:
There are no good alround devices such as mobile phone with video camera + foto-camera .... . Who has entitlements for each takes a different situation Gerät.Das should be synonymous with the camcorder to be taken into account.

5.Frage:
I have a Mini DV camcorder and edit everything gefilm I have on my HDD.

6. Question:
Panasonic NV GS-180, actually a good camcorder but unfortunately far too easily and compactly for smooth images.

Miscellaneous Notes:
I find that rather camcorder Bigger and harder to be If. A pistol grip from the Super8 time would be synonymous not bad, because he is better than a visual OIS stabilized. If the camcorder better objective (as in SLR cameras) get with manual settings (sharpness, zoom ...) which is missing in all camcorders unfortunately. There should be more synonymous buttons affixed to the outside. What bissher everything on the menu should be set
as a button or switch s.Camcorders applied (at least the most important functions).



Antwort von Andreas_Kiel:

Quote: 1. What your take on? Or, if your camcorder you a want to buy what do you want to include?
s.Geburtstage
rarely

b. Family Celebrations
rarely

c. Weddings
never

d. sports such as snowboarding, skateboarding
often (sailing!)

e. Holidays
always

f. own shorts
in work

g. Documentation
I try it with "e" to combine

h. Documentation Project (University School, job)
no

i. other (designation would be super)

Quote: 2. Use your automatic mode?
yes and no. If I "just so" in the area rumschleiche ;-) then yes, synonymous with the sailing, because I only have a handful freihabe. No, if I have time for the single scene did. Then let me help of the automatic and manual adjust the outcome to.

Quote: 3. Which manual functions are important for you?
s.manueller Focus
yes, for me ko-criterion

b. manual aperture setting
yes, for me ko-criterion

c. Manual White Balance
yes, for me ko-criterion

d. Display Calibration
yes

e. other (possibly named)
Weight high, Connections, optical stab. Lens, tape drive

Quote: 4. Still uses the image of your function?

b. no, take stills from the tape if necessary (of HD PrintBar quite well when the size limits).

Quote: 5. Use your editing of filmed material? (Title for tape or clip-in camcorder to enter if no why not? Too cumbersome?)
b. no, that's all stupid & towels too cumbersome.

Quote: 6. What kind of camera you use?
a.) SonyHDR-FX1;
b.) SonyVX 1000;
c.) SonyTRV-140E

Quote: Also, the opinions of advanced you are with prosumer camcorders such as Canon XL-H1 or SonyHDR-FX1 employ are interesting, because your probably a sharp eye to do what the consumer camcorders is amiss!

Disturbs me with the overload (digital-) functions, the movie just one foul and irreparably distort Recording: sepia, negative etc. are just a few of these scary things.
In TRV-140E is synonymous of this a little frills, but synonymous manual exposure / focus and a clever viewfinders, long-life batteries, etc.
Apparently, the pile functions effectively, such as advertising - ineradicable - the 200-fold digital zoom and digital image stabilization. When you open the boxes of my TRV-140E quollen tens stickers, which we all s.die (in fact quite excellent) Camera bappen can here super, duper because, look: I have the longest!
Then annoy me nor ghoulish touch-screen menu, but something is not really manageable. Color are ok, have less color, the color of the FX1 is quite good, but could later dissolve. The viewfinders of the TRV-140E is still b / w, I personally find better.
A protective cover for the lens should be stable somewhere s.der Camera can be mounted to the FX1 lamellas are exactly correct. Everything else bamselt loose in the area around, rattle in the wind or lost.

I think we should synonymous but the view of the general audience does not forget these are the beginners who are themselves times a video from holiday or want to bring the Erbtante a VHS tape of last birthday. An "audience" thinks it probably only once, hardly anyone. Who then developed further ambitions, will be sometime after the next hardware-class scout.

For beginners, the C