Frage von Addie:
Sorry
But now I must again nachhaken:
actually I had already decided on a Canon HF100 - but now I see in miser, that again will cost nearly 800, the HF10 synonymous (; even a few £ cheaper).
So I ask myself: there would not be the HG20 an alternative? Then I save to a miser-HF10 at a price of approximately EUR 530 incredible amount of money.
- While you record to hard drive, but it synonymous to SD card as the HF100. And the plate is not a disadvantage right? (; Noise?)
- It is characterized with 24Mbit to 17Mbit when compared to HF100. Even if probably does not make too much difference.
- HG20 offers even infrared recording and peaking
- Wide Angleso virtually no difference between filter size equal to
- Viewfinder HG20 has a
- HG20, however, has NO manual Aperture and NO Tonanzeige
- Why miser in the HG20 "AVCHD (; 1920x1080 @
25p) writes," but only in the HF (; 1920x1080), but both make 25p, or are these different methods? Here too, the test is under
Specials: 25p mode. On the other hand is synonymous here:
no 1 / 25 second exposure time in the Cinema mode What does this mean? Is it synonymous with the HF10?
The image quality is assessed both as very good - so where's the hook for the HG20, which is so much cheaper? Because of this 1/25-Sekunde-Geschichte about?
Antwort von JanMAG:
Hello Addie, actually I had already decided on a Canon HF100 - but now I see in miser, that again will cost nearly 800, the HF10 synonymous (; even a few £ cheaper). why you want you ever buy a Canon HF100, which will cost more money than a HG20 and simply is WORSE?
So I ask myself: there would not be the HG20 an alternative? Then I save to a miser-HF10 at a price of approximately EUR 530 incredible amount of money. Of course she is!
- While you record to hard drive, but it synonymous to SD card as the HF100. And the plate is not a disadvantage right? (; Noise?) No, is not a disadvantage. Unless you like films at altitudes of> 3000m, there you should be on memory card or resume tape, because the hard drive otherwise serious damage can wear them. Noise, there's not synonymous, but I want to tell you s.dieser agency that the sound in general HG20 Rauscht significantly more than the HF100, but what with the hard drive has nothing to do.
- It is characterized with 24Mbit to 17Mbit when compared to HF100. Even if probably does not make too much difference. But of course, the Bildqualiät is better. By the way something synonymous provides sharper images than the HF100.
- HG20 offers even infrared recording and peaking
- Wide Angleso virtually no difference between filter size equal to Yes detected toll: P
- Viewfinder HG20 has a Where did you get this information to me is a mystery. No, she has NO VIEWFINDER. (; Probably a confusion with the HG21, which is 200 ¬ more expensive and this one viewfinder and a 120GB hard drive) has
- HG20, however, has NO manual Aperture and NO Tonanzeige Even those who you said that, I would like to know times. It has both a manual Aperture manual level control as synonymous.
- Why miser in the HG20 "AVCHD (; 1920x1080 @ 25p) writes," but only in the HF (; 1920x1080), but both make 25p, or are these different methods? Here too, the test is under Specials: 25p mode.
On the other hand is synonymous here: no 1 / 25 second exposure time in the Cinema mode
What does this mean? Is it synonymous with the HF10? No, both have a 25p mode and yes, the Canon HG20 is the 25p mode is not lower than 1 / 50 with the exposure, so you have virtually no "low-light advantage" due to a prolonged exposure time. That would be crap anyway, since this leads to beautiful Geruckel - in daylight anyway you should not shoot with 1 / 25 shutter, so is half the wild. ;)
I hope I could help you.
Sincerely,
January
Antwort von Addie:
Thank you for your help, Jan!
why you want you ever buy a Canon HF100, which will cost more money than a HG20 and simply is WORSE? I ask me now synonymous ... ;-) Plain and simply because I overlooked the simple to the Canon HG20 Choice and me synonymous None had made as an alternative on it carefully. Was it coincidence that I discovered today.
Probably a confusion with the HG21, which is 200 ¬ more expensive and this one viewfinder and a 120GB hard drive) has
Yes, you're right, sorry confused with HG21 ...
Even those who you said that, I would like to know times. It has both a manual Aperture as synonymous manual level control The information I have here Slashcam of the test site. It says both the HG20 as synonymous with the HG21:
"Manual Aperture?" No No " and
"Sound-display?" No No " see picture, or have I misinterpreted as what?
That would be crap anyway, since this leads to beautiful Geruckel To a certain extent, this is indeed just wanted to get closer to the film look, but I admit, synonymous with the HV20, I found the 25F mode from the picture but her pretty (; little softer), but for (; to fast) pans bad.
Rensensoren by some but I have read that they found the pan at 25p a HG20 better and find them because of the 24Mbit synonymous better than the HF100 at 25p a pan 17Mbit. Is there something in it.
And to finish: the AVCHD editing s.PC - as requiring 24 Mbps versus 17 Mbps again more PC performance?
I would be able to cut the absence of native Turbo PC and editing software in any case not AVCHD, Edius NEO 2 can not anyway, right? Were the first time with making the Canopus HQ codec, which is synonymous with older PC's functions. Have a dual core with 2x 2.67 GHz, 3 GB DDR-2 RAM, 512 MB GraKa (; Ati Radeon), so I can easily cut HDV natively (; still NEO 1.1).
Thanks again for your help.
Antwort von JanMAG:
The information I have here Slashcam of the test site. It says both the HG20 as synonymous with the HG21:
"Manual Aperture?" No No "
and
"Sound-display?" No No "
see picture, or have I misinterpreted as what? No. You do not have - probably a mistake of Slashcam!
And to finish: the AVCHD editing s.PC - as requiring 24 Mbps versus 17 Mbps again more PC performance? Since there is no significant difference.
I would be able to cut the absence of native Turbo PC and editing software in any case not AVCHD, Edius NEO 2 can not anyway, right? Were the first time with making the Canopus HQ codec, which is synonymous with older PC's functions. Have a dual core with 2x 2.67 GHz, 3 GB DDR-2 RAM, 512 MB GraKa (; Ati Radeon), so I can easily cut HDV natively (; still NEO 1.1). I cut myself with Edius. Yes, the AVCHD stream must first be converted so that Edius can do anything. There are AVCHDHQ the Canopus converter that converts the data into either the code or simply CanopusHQ only brings in MPEG2 format. For your PC that is absolutely no problem;)
Antwort von Addie:
Nice to hear!
In the long run, I would like to Blu-ray output, but I have a burner.
But I have a Popcorn Hour, now on average, the HDV M2T (files), the highest level of quality directly via HDMI can play on my plasma.
In which file format you are ready for AVCHD projects with NEO 2 sinvollerweise out if the quality should be as lossless as possible? I think that the PCH can play pretty much all file formats.
've Read that NEO 2 synonymous can export as H.264, but I do not know how good is the.
But what do you give the files in NEO? Or you burn directly to BD?
Antwort von Addie:
Ah yes, again ;-) And the all-important final questions:
You can see the difference right?
So my previous system: ready HV20 HDV Project of the highest quality as M2T or MPEG-2 HD output
compared to a finished
AVCHD HG20 Project of the highest quality, output as? No idea, issued as H.264/MPEG-4 or BD?
Antwort von AndreasBloechl:
How is it worse to the fact that the HF10/100 than an HG20? When comparing the overall times in the test and then you will see the difference. Not that I am now defending the HF10 which I have, just makes me a little was so thoughtful to post some here.
And besides, I paid for my HF10 650Euro the retailer and the network it is even cheaper. How did you get the price difference.
Antwort von rudi:
[quote = "JanMAG"]
The information I have here Slashcam of the test site. It says both the HG20 as synonymous with the HG21:
"Manual Aperture?" No No "
and
"Sound-display?" No No "
see picture, or have I misinterpreted as what? No. You do not have - probably a mistake of Slashcam! Yes, indeed, an error on our part. Is now corrected.
Regards
Rudi
Antwort von Addie:
And besides, I paid for my HF10 650Euro the retailer and the network it is even cheaper. How did you get the price difference. http://geizhals.at/deutschland/?fs = Canon HF10 + & in = Okay, the EU price is more favorable to some, at least for the HF100, but I did not shop in the UK order now.
Other Shops / price comparison sites I did not look now ...
Antwort von AndreasBloechl:
Here, one quick search
http://www.pricerunner.de/pl/8-1059346/Camcorders- LEGRIA Canon-HF10-preisvergleich-shopping
And I'm sure that they will be even cheaper.
Antwort von Addie:
Ah, okay, then I would have to search again.
But the HG20 nevertheless seems to be getting cheaper - so if both make cameras just about the same good shots and the HG20 has a few more features than the HF10 (, 0), then I would naturally resort to the HG20.
The only thing that bothers me is the main strong audio noise in the HG20. Is that the HF10 (, 0) much better?
The drive whirr of the HV20 that is always totally annoyed me, it would be reluctant to replace it with a "Noise" ...
Oh yes, and: made the HF10 (, 0) differently than the HG20-25p shots synonymous with 1/25-Sekunde?
Antwort von AndreasBloechl:
I have read of the HG that she shut down if excessive vibration can occur if one wants to record a concert. So this does not in HF. I have no cam out of the house are installed in the desired more still machans parts. Even in the test here, the RF has been able to achieve more points Bildqualimäßg I think they will not take much. What bothers me s.meisten when my cam is the piano, because you get scratches very fast but this is just purely secondary. Otherwise, I am fully satisfied with it.
edit: 25p, I have tested not yet.
Antwort von Addie:
I have read of the HG that she shut down if excessive vibration can occur if one wants to record a concert. So this does not in HF. I have no cam out of the house are installed in the desired more still machans parts. That was with the switch-off when I read the HG synonymous, but believe that we can handle it. Generally synonymous but I had the idea that I am not really a mechanical part wanted more.
Let's see.
Antwort von AndreasBloechl:
Yes, the leaves are off the menu, only it is aware of the plate is then not sure if they are not harmed.
Antwort von Daigoro:
Here, one quick search
http://www.pricerunner.de/pl/8-1059346/Camcorders- LEGRIA Canon-HF10-preisvergleich-shopping
And I'm sure that they will be even cheaper. A shop which is called Killa-Price? And the only one that has so cheap? And no review of and never belongs? (; Import version from Uzbekistan? "Fallen" from truck "?)
The decision to buy has probably taken too long. The HF100 is discontinued model - there's only (as a residual item, if you have glueck guenstig but tendendiell when we evaluate the past experience trust) is more expensive. The longer you wait, the more expensive it will be well, until they re no longer exist.
HF200's become favorable, but no real improvement - as is so often the case with new / cheaper models - although it has in the database Slashcam more than total points than the other two.
Antwort von AndreasBloechl:
Right, you have the right to the point. When I bought my just over 5 weeks I have had some sent a link where they would have been almost $ 100 cheaper than that around 570euro. These links now lead to a price of nearly 800Euro. So I think the HF10 and the HF100 is synonymous only get more difficult to. Amazon at this time was much cheaper than the HF10, the HF100 synonymous although it has a memory int what the HF100 does not. The mean if you want, is not so.
Antwort von Addie:
Is really silly - perhaps I should see time in the used good for a quote.
Otherwise: Can we really turn off the HG20 in these specific situations, the hard drive and start all over somehow not only on SD card, so the hard drive is not broken?
The new HF20 (, 0) is rated very poor here in picture quality - and that is what matters to me during the shoot s.allermeisten to ...
Antwort von AndreasBloechl:
The HF20 think I will be only slightly worse in lowlight. The image stabilizer is, in my opinion, however, have improved.
It's really not easy because I think you're right.
I have very very long synonymous me of sony needed between the CX11 and the HF10 decide. The price of the HF10 but then decided the issue because I had the CX11 never got around 650 euros.
Antwort von Daigoro:
The new HF20 (, 0) is rated very poor here in picture quality - and that is what matters to me during the shoot s.allermeisten to ... As long as the Bildqualiaet still "satisfactory" or "good" is, has the worst rating is much less significance than one might think reading the pure Test wants (and if you have no other criteria).
If perfect picture quality and lowlight are important, we need not search before the <$ 1000 class - there's the blind and one eye.
The HF20 (, 0) is synonymous of nature from more wide-angle, which is not entirely irrelevant. All in all, not quite as easy a decision.
Antwort von AndreasBloechl:
Right, Wide Angleist not synonymous with contempt because you're right.
Only lowlight was damned important to me and I think the HF10 but then has a slight advantage to the HF20.
Like I said if you can live with that, I would probably intervene synonymous to HF20.
Antwort von Jan:
It should be noted yet that the HG recording disk 20 at approximately 1/3- 1 / 4 more power needed and the camera is much heavier and more voluminous (; what you see now is positive or negative can be synonymous).
And has discontinued the Canon cameras, hard disk (; what can be assessed one way or the keyword-eg spare parts), in the autumn of models is no hard drive camera. When spring 2010 is not synonymous (; as I believe) - then the wars with HDD at Canon.
But both cameras are good, (very difficult to distinguish for the average citizen not to, Picture), you have to stop only the advantages of each system to compare with his opinion. If you like about 5 h (in top quality, filmed like 24 Mbit) and do not want to spend too much money for memory cards and get along with the thicker and heavier camera - which was to take the HG 20th
Although a majority of my clients is the HG 20 & not see hands-on "fat" and heavy, so that the masses prefer the HF models surrenders. This should, however, each user decide for themselves.
VG
January
Antwort von AndreasBloechl:
As Jan, still more power. The Batteries on my HF10 extremst're bad and have to load almost every day of the holiday. I have not been immediately regretted having bought the large as a substitute, but now I have two small but am not at all satisfied with where their life.
Antwort von Daigoro:
Only lowlight was damned important to me and I think the HF10 but then has a slight advantage to the HF20. Yes, but synonymous extremely overestimated.
Most users seem to think "ok, I want good pictures, so I take a camera with 'good' (; act for the priced) lowlight, then I do not need a light synonymous.
But I did not have any consumer camera view that makes really good pictures with little light. Maximum bad and not quite as bad.
If you want good pictures, you have (that make for light, is difficult as amateur filmmakers, because construction lights in St. Peter does not like to have seen:), or anyway with a live image degradation .. and much much more money to spend, for ne other camera, the border area is down significantly next.
In fact, even shame, that drive the Manufacturer is still the same game in years and, thanks to well-known "Verschlimmbesserungen" (relative, smaller chip with more pixels), all progress again, but as I have said nothing new.
Antwort von AndreasBloechl:
Yes you are right, only less bad is synonymous a little better.
My SonyTRV33 with 1 / 4, 8 Inch CCD has since been much worse.
But as you probably are synonymous believe you should not hold the size of the CMOS as the only real selling point. The cam should already have gone into this and not just because the chip is bigger etws heist that far from being the man with the cam then happier.
Antwort von Jan:
In the HG of 20 man goes from 5-15% more power consumption when the hard drive is used. In Sonyand Panasonic even higher.
VG
January
Antwort von AndreasBloechl:
Jan, Cam really need this so much more power for the synonymous coding in the somewhat aufwändigerne codec. My TRV33 indeed holds very small with Batteries by more than the HF10. I was honestly a bit shocked as it was so quickly. Synonymous, and if the HF10 is turned completely off, he still eats electricity, I can not watch synonymous with the TRV33. Why is this so, I'll always get out in the HF10 now the Battery.
Antwort von Addie:
How's that with the electricity consumption in the HG20 - if I only record to SDHC card, the hard drive is then synonymous always off or always running car with? Which of course would be nonsense? Or you can disable it manual?
And if the hard drive time should give up the ghost (; had read of the vibration problem), we can then take next with no problems at SD card or is it the whole camcorder to go?
Antwort von Jan:
In the HG 20 manual stop is about 5-15% depending on the duration of more power consumption when using the hard drive. Is synonymous logical to stop because the hard drive needs more power (; eg moving parts).
Other companies see it similar.
(For a shorter time, days) with camera is off, it should remove the battery actually very little.
VG
January
Antwort von Addie:
This is understandable.
Aha - the "In use, the hard drive" sounds so real that they speak with the appropriate non-use recording card just is not in use - and thus requires less power, right?
Perhaps you notice the synonymous during the shoot, when the hard drive starts up, "or in the switch to turn off the SDHC?
Would not the question: what is with the camera when the plate abraucht - total loss or can I still record on card? Can I try it, I indeed, as I open the casing and depart the cable of the plate, then they synonymous needs no power more ... ;-))).
Antwort von RickyMartini:
What is the HG20, if you only SDHC card to record eh? That is totally bananas!
Then take but HF10/11!
The HG20 gives you longer recording times with the HDD. What is more, that there can be no problems with faulty cards. That the HDD fails, is found only in the case of raw violence.
Antwort von Addie:
I WISH my HF10 or 100 so synonymous, but got 300 or 400 EUR more - noooo! THAT would a banana.
Source: miser, HF10 for 849, -, HF 100 for 949, - the HG20, I called for 524, - get.
Is indeed synonymous not "tragic" that the HG has a hard drive - only the background is that I am not really a mechanical / moving parts longer wanted in a camera, but it's not worth the money and the HG20 has indeed synonymous other benefits compared to the HF10/100 THAT I would have found thus banana.
And with the disconnection of course, was only a joke!
Antwort von RickyMartini:
Ok! ;)
The HDD you should not be seen as a disadvantage, because the cards can sometimes "have misfired.
Antwort von Addie:
Good to know, thanks. I'm curious. I Habe eine Transcend ordered with 16 GB because I have read that should work well.
Antwort von AndreasBloechl:
Oh Oh, then time to read something with.
http://www.videotreffpunkt.com/thread.php?threadid=9411
And the plate may vary, synonymous as normal as any other disk. Why should not be able to fail when they shut down even at extreme volume at concerts for example, that make so not in vain.
Antwort von B.DeKid:
Wosind the now the guys have since the ne SSD installed in the DIY project .... it's the whole intressant again ;-)
MfG
B. DeKid
Antwort von Addie:
Oh Oh, then time to read something with.
http://www.videotreffpunkt.com/thread.php?threadid=9411
Shit ...!
Well, but it's just a guarantee can never have. On some runs it without problems, some can not. And as you say, the plate can vary synonymous. One can only hope that everything goes well. 'm Usually really more SanDisk fan, but I had read several times that the cards a good P / L ratio. I will see it.
Which are otherwise the most reliable? SanDisk, Panasonic, Corsair?
Antwort von AndreasBloechl:
So I have two ExtremMemory, one of them in operation since 2002 in my Digiknipse and the second in the other, but since only about two years ago. Then I usually only SanDisk, and all run without problems, both a CF and an SD synonymous. But I have a Transcend synonymous still in the Nikon D50 for some time but is just a normal SD, but I switch it out now by SanDisk, this company is too dangerous.
Transcend SDHC For me, I have now bought a 16gig SanDisk Ultra 2, at 40 euros, so just to 4euro cost more than the Transcend was broken. I will in the future if no SanDisk fails buy from me only such.
Synonymous I made a mistake because I was not the beginning of the holiday s.im int memory was filmed, I will in future only on this film and then every day for the card back over so many, I have a backup and 2 hours I usually anyway when a normal holiday.
Antwort von Addie:
Okay
thank you for the experience. Maybe I peddle the Transcend then equal of the top back on before something is lost and get myself a SanDisk equal. Of which have been (synonymous for years one in my digital camera, 2 Micro-SD cards synonymous for over 2 years in operation, mobile phone, Mp3 player) and never problems. The small additional cost, it should come as a value.
Perhaps I have read about the Transcend cards fast ...
Antwort von AndreasBloechl:
You're working for very many without problems, but lately we hear of more failures.
Antwort von Addie:
Hm
So with the initialization of the HG20 on the card does not go before, there is always error. Fast initialization synonymous, synonymous Studio has worked. Information on the card, I could not sit because the camera says "card check", very funny. Where's s.der card or I do something wrong?
Antwort von AndreasBloechl:
Sounds like a card.
I would get myself s.deiner point the program H2testw. This is free and you can stick to test each and every card with it, I like to test each stick or card so that when I get it, that's for micht as important as a HDD, the same test I always synonymous with the tool manufacturer.
Antwort von Modellbahner:
Looking for views on whether the write-protect switch is synonymous in the final position, move the things are already in the affairs of times. The switch must be 100% in the final position.
Bernd
Antwort von AndreasBloechl:
It then writes the Cam immediately.
Antwort von Modellbahner:
When the switch is not in the end position, is to check the message map.
My experience bernd
Antwort von AndreasBloechl:
What a switch? If you think the write-protect the card is quite clear that this is enabled in the action, and consider not map. As I'm sure because this was the only one that has recognized my Cam still with the Transcend card. Otherwise, with this card was with me no more, only the recognition of write protection.
edit: Just tried, and is active when I read the card then want to set the action in which she takes on map immediately comes the message: "The deletion of the card lock is enabled"
Antwort von Modellbahner:
Andreas when the switch is not in an end position.
bernd
Antwort von AndreasBloechl:
Even now tested. So the slide for securing the card exactly on the center does nothing, the cam takes up without hesitation.
Antwort von Addie:
Why always synonymous, today I was able to make photos at once (; had the card) yesterday in a USB stick s.Calculator to dub the MTS files. Initializing via HG20 I have not tried but I later try again.
Incidentally, I made a mistake while writing yesterday: The "full" initialization of the card on the HG20 failed, the "quick work", however. Maybe later I try again the full, if I have emptied the card. Then sign up again.
Antwort von AndreasBloechl:
All clear.
Antwort von Yerri:
I would get myself s.deiner point the program H2testw. This is free and you can test each card and stick to each ... and now I would not do. Delete or full initialization only in the camera. Such a stress test in the calculator, I would not expect a card. But to each his own. I was with 3 16Gb Transcend today in about 18 months, never problems.
Antwort von AndreasBloechl:
What is there to be stressful. It is indeed synonymous people who want such a card vollfilmen s.Stück, what they have then?
Even if I want to copy the int to the memory card is completely otherwise. If a card that does not cooperate so they can be the start of your password.
Antwort von Yerri:
I write this, therefore because just a friend like the same thing has happened with you after the test with your above H2testw SanDisk chip in on a calculator, there were problems with his HF100 and error messages. This chip has previously worked perfectly.
But what solls. Exactly how it behaves with the of "model railroaders" move above the switch. Even that was already confirmed to me of another page.
But now I'm outside because I do not like talking to walls .* g *
Antwort von AndreasBloechl:
Have you read through my problem exactly synonymous. I had initialized after the test with the card and although H2testw Full synonymous and then the entire map is almost vollgefilmt, all without problems. Even on holiday gabs it up to 40min. no problems, and of one day to another was then broken.
I believe that we should no preference whether card or HDD before testing so as not to entäuscht retrospectively then the error only occurs. Because not only as the one I am using this medium before the first complete special tests almost everyone here if you do umlesen so. I have been synonymous in the video meeting once again I got the new Sandisk should leave immediately and with Meher vollschreiben Files not only a single file. And that's what I have again made synonymous and used the tool. Would be topsy-turvy world when we should not do or should and would contribute to damaging the card.
Of course, you should initialize the card again when you're finished with the testing, what I have been synonymous.
And with the read, I can only repeat what I have myself tested here. To me it is quite synonymous no preference whether there other Cams show what's different, but with me it's the way I post. Why should I then say something else??
