Frage von LH:
hallihallo ...
we (jan and francesco ^ ^) are in a training for mediengestalter ... we are concerned mainly with conceptual film and implementation ... and now that we are getting more and more orders and it may be synonymous soon comes whether we buy equipment, we have something about which we have no one answered ...
we would like to rotate ntsc ... Germany is of course in a somewhat difficult sache ... the effect is basically just that we have ntsc optik of ... everything else is pretty no preference ... All, of course, still on pal-equipment (TV, etc) can run.
how to make the s.besten ... or ... geht das überhaupt?
we should ne ntsc camera you can buy or perhaps somewhere around the son ding ma borrow to try?
gibts or perhaps filter for premiere final cut etc, or as with the optical pal so you can convert it looks like ntsc?
... so ... these are the whole question ... hope someone can answer them: D
gruss
francesco and jan
(LH - Media Design): D
Antwort von Nicht eingeloggt:
gibts or perhaps filter for premiere final cut etc, or as with the optical pal so you can convert it looks like ntsc? How is the special aesthetics of NTSC? On all modern PAL-NTSC devices can be played, and it looks like a very clean video. Or do you look to the muddy old NTSC TV series? (> Color correction)
The old prejudices concerning NTSC, are now hardly any. If you have an NTSC tape in PAL land would play, would be a slight "smoothing" everything you erreichtet. Only the insiders would notice the difference.
It would help to more accurately describe what you want to achieve.
Antwort von steveb:
can easily Jerkiness synonymous (NTSC than PAL 60 plays)
Antwort von LH:
hi ...
So ... that no longer format differences, there is our hope scho mal rise a bit ...
So ... exactly what we mean:
you know for sure:
zappt watch TV in their rum and you can directly on the first glance whether what you see as an American or German production is ... it just looks like the picture ... I hope you know that ^ ^
we both know in any case, the ... naja ... what is the exact change is somehow very difficult to make ... that is why we ask so synonymous ... have a presumption is now that the saturation is slightly higher or directly with higher saturation in ntsc is taken? ... can not say whether it is ... but we are quite sure it is not the ONLY ...
hope now it's become a bit clearer: D ... and thank you ever for the first answer for everything and have the following times in advance ...
francesco & jan
Antwort von beiti:
A special aesthetics of NTSC, there are definitely not - certainly not in the digital area, where the term NTSC is no longer really applies.
What (former) U.S. series norm conditionally indicates, is vsdie very poor standard conversion, which in the case of fast movements bucking and / or double contours leads. Even current series are not entirely free of them, for example, I have earlier in "Monk" a rather jerky flight seen.
Since most U.S. series with 30 frames per second film to be rotated, it is clear even before the Nomwandlung a slightly different aesthetic than for feature films, with the 24 frames per second and then run into by 2/3-Pulldown NTSC format bruising . If it all goes through a standard transformer and resulting 50 fields per second are, it looks different again.
All these differences are related only to movements in the static settings, we do not see it.
Everything else, which U.S. series of the German series is different, has nothing more with the video system. The colors are then of the attitude of the camera, the film material of the setting for the sampling and of the other post from. This starts with simple things such as the used film material, or at all, whether on film (30 frames per second) or video (60 fields per second) has been rotated. The man knows so synonymous of PAL (25 frames of film or 50 video fields). Then of course, play synonymous camera work and lighting a role (ie the work of the Director Of Photography), and last but not least, the set design (colors of the props, etc.).
NTSC video, as such, has no special look, just like PAL. NTSC solves vertically slightly worse on - but that's been synonymous. I myself have PAL to NTSC video transfers, and it looks to the casual observer just like native NTSC video (only s.schnellen movements you can see the transformation). Conversely, does the conversion of synonymous NTSC after PAL very tidy, if a modern standard transducer is used (eg, the studio recordings on CNN International).
Using concrete examples of the phenomenon might be better to investigate. The best would be examples that demonstrate the desired look, and counter examples, this look just does not show. Subject is rather old series or new synonymous? Subject only synonymous series or movies? Where there is more video footage (eg, sitcoms) or sampled film (eg police series)? Do the Effects always on or only when motion?
Antwort von Videostudio:
zappt watch TV in their rum and you can directly on the first glance whether what you see as an American or German production is ... it just looks like the picture ... I hope you know that ^ ^ Well, it says probably not
Desperate Housewives or other recent productions. Let's say
King of Queens? Because you're right, of course, with the higher color saturation. The aesthetic is also that of a particularly shallow Buehnenausleuchtung (series is very fast and cheap is always in the same scenes with always the same Highkey light produced). Then 's not realism to the entire production design has the charm of a McDonald's lounge. Colorful sweet sadness, and therefore virtually shadowless light. Since it is 60i video that is expected to 50i down, has the quality suffered synonymous. Or: What do you mean?
The fact that
the bull of Toelz different than
Streets Of San Frans Cisco has not only with the cinematic work of the Americans to do. Bourn Identity 2, for example in German German from Berlin strange. Has probably synonymous with the typical German light to do so.
Antwort von Svend5:
Well, if your in the conception and implementation of Shooting "((for me this means" Directing & Design ") are, you should understand a little better able to make. That is what customers ultimately synonymous when it comes to understand how someone will spend their money ....
Ok. But now to the actual. If you are only a little in the professional film and commercial business moves, know that your ideas of a vaguely described "NTSC" Looks do nothing and as I my "SO GAR NIXXXXX" with NTSC to do. Rudi Carell look from the 70igern, then you will notice a similar Farbmonochromie as in "Streets of San Francisco. It is true that NTSC is still a little flat out at when you compare it to PAL to play on, at any rate is the experience of my spots, which I consider to be America in NTSC have rotated. But if you described the effects of jerky images, flat look, etc. want to have: Do it in the post! The steeper Kontraste described a U.S. TV series: Do it in the mail. Or how do you have to do that? Would but the technical conditions of NTSC actually contradict ....
To the point that U.S. films look different: Sure, but that did what with better, more subtle illumination to be done. The take for example greater lighting units and provide them away next. This creates a softer light with softer shadows ..... also have their films more budget, so that you can verfriemeln more ..... In the U.S. there are so-called "Dino-Lights", which exists in Europe does not exist, I think not more than one in London too ..... you can see significant differences in night illumination: Where in Europe of the background disappears completely in black, There is shooting in the U.S. are still drawing. The reason: Money. More light needs more time and money. So, rising at the right times inside the craft, and forget all the (beautiful) computer scrap. Then kämt your not synonymous with the idea to NTSC here to want to shoot .... What a nonsense. And learn arithmetic. Because then your kämt behind that s.Ende tech is not only nonsense, but is synonymous is much more expensive (true standard conversions are expensive).
So much fun and give you the freedom, not every idiot to believe that the wise pseudo-wisdom in the room is!
So long!
Antwort von prem:
hehe ...
but this came nu bissl bös ... what solls ... think you want us nothing bad ... So ... As I said ... we start with the grade s.with kram ... totally sophisticated background knowledge we have of course not ... otherwise we would certainly not ask ... and about how we describe it ... we describe it here so no customer ... but other people on the same page in this dialog is how we ... thought the description is sufficient ... but okay ... I at least try to mention times examples ...
So ...
filme as synonymous both series:
sex in the city
friends
raymond all love (and all the other comedy kram)
csi forensic and similar series
Charlie's Angels (and similar new-aek nice strip ^ ^)
pulp fiction
The Grudge (and other horror movies)
but somewhat older synonymous kram like Basic Instinct or dirty harry
etc.
sees everything "American" from ...
verliebt in berlin
good times bad times (and all other soaps)
Alarm for Cobra 11 (or other criminal action or series)
lola rennt
crash boom bang
and other German films
etc.
sees everything, "German" from ...
so ... these are the examples that I can install ...
may be that I am now fully involved in the attack fettnapf a long time ago is ... but I think "dresden" I saw "American" from ... ?
hab grad nochmal now between what was American and German in the tv out and her gezappt ... and I would like to tell you exactly what I mean ... but I simply can not fix ... but it turns definitely not about the movement ... at least not primarily ... think it's farbgebung and brightness ... problem is when I stop and do not have the same recording, I can not say whether lighter or darker or more or less saturation saturation NEN certain color or less, or more, etc. ... I'm sorry ... hope so that you can now begin a little more?
gruss
francesco & jan
Antwort von Bernd E.:
Since most U.S. series with 30 frames per second film to be rotated Is this really so? I went so far assumed that film, eg 16 or 35mm, standard worldwide with 24 frames per second is rotated - unless you want certain effects such as slow motion or time lapse to reach.
The man knows so synonymous of PAL (25 frames of film or 50 video fields) PAL is a TV system, has thus recorded on film with nothing to do. Film has 24 frames per second, in PAL video section there are 25 full-time or as most common form of 50 fields.
Gruß Bernd E.
Antwort von Gast1:
The more recent American series have been used for over a year already produced in HD (and in the U.S. sent so synonymous). Means that the SD-PAL German variants have implemented no longer BonBon those colors as before.
Previously, the series in Germany partly synonymous only with a reduced bitrate implemented / delivered, which has the muddy NTSC color probably even greater.
Color can create these effects, possibly synonymous conversion of PAL to NTSC.
Antwort von beiti:
I went so far assumed that film, eg 16 or 35mm, standard worldwide with 24 frames per second will be rotated That is true in the field of cinema. But for television rotate the Amis is often synonymous with 29.97 fps, so it is better in NTSC can palpate.
PAL is a TV system, has thus recorded on film with nothing to do. not what you're saying. :)
ex in the city (....)
but somewhat older synonymous kram like Basic Instinct or dirty harry
etc.
sees everything "American" from ...
verliebt in berlin (....)
and other German films
etc.
sees everything, "German" from ... Well, at least we have clarified that there is nothing to do with NTSC has. (The technology for movies is in the U.S. and Germany are identical.)
Since you have very different examples anführst, you can still set up a rule worse.
"CSI" for example, has a very own and idiosyncratic look that is so when there None other series. "Friends" on the other hand is an example of a video production studio sitcom without special image effects.
"Basic Instinct" was a film that probably 80% with the Steadycam and / or Kamerakran rotated, which he gave a special Dynamics.
Just as (technically) different are your German examples: Most soaps are very cheap on rotated video and see synonymous not much different from an amateur video. "Alarm for Cobra 11" to 16 mm is rotated. "Run Lola Run" and other German films, however, emerged on 35-mm film with the same Arri cameras, the synonymous use of the Amis. Also, the film samples that you see on TV to get, are responsible for German and American films like: The film will be of 24 to 25 frames per second and then each picture to 2 PAL fields distributed.
If it actually periodic differences in the picture there (which I own observation could not confirm), then the in the way the film makers are. The camera can work, lighting and post-production workflow the same concern as the actual events on the screen.
No Question: I see synonymous very quickly whether a series of German or American. It has but little with the picture quality (apart of such poor standard of conversion in the old series) to do. This has much more to do with that typical American Picture cars driving through that red hydrant angemalt is that sidewalks are not paved or concreted plate but have shown that private houses American mailboxes and garden fence does not have that highway signs are green instead of yellow, that living in tasteless pastel colors are that of a white-kitchen wall phone with a very long cord hanging that numerous Penner their liquor in brown paper bags have stuck that policemen dressed in black and these are strange and service marks herumzeigen approximately one third of policeman darker skin color is that of the father with his sons into the football stadium but for baseball, etc.
Synonymous one hears the sound, the apparent synchronization and add the fact that the people "Jack" or "John" or "Cathryn" or "Rachel" to say that the children and their parents "Mom and Dad" and call their turn teachers with "coach" to address.
Would be interesting to Comparison British films and series used. Look at first glance more like German or American films such as? For television there is produced in PAL, and movie content on an international standard. Just like in Germany.
Even more interesting, I think "German Hollywood films like" Outbreak "(Wolfgang Petersen as director, Michael Ballhaus as DOP). There is therefore the entire responsibility for the appearance of the image in the hands of Germans. Actors and arenas, however, are American. Does the movie "German" or "American" from?
Antwort von Svend5:
Ok. Now I nochx, again late at night, early morning: Sorry if my "contribution" last night sounded a bit nasty: is okay if you ask ....! Again: The entire tech. Details (Pictures Frequency, HDTV, etc.) you should look not in terms of interest! As written yesterday, are the differences s.Ausleuchten Look! Check out "The Perfume", it does not "German" from. Have a look at many U.S. sitcoms, you see the similar GZSZ aus .... My tip: For advertising. As you can see what looks you can create, here, today and in Dtschl. Or times in postproduction companies or on their homepages (Arri, Das Werk, Second Unit, etc.). Informs you about times "Bleichbadüberbrückung": that is the Seven Look (monochrome with some bright colors). That gets you out in the laboratory (Bleichbad will be omitted) or in the telecine / scanning ... I hope this helps you next ....!
LG Svend5
Antwort von LH:
do not head ... habs nich personally speaking:)
So ... outbreak is definitely American in ... the parfum synonymous (at least what I've seen trailer) ... and if the German productions were of course is very interesting ...
So ... ntsc-effekt (so we have called) can thus be as follows:
- Ausrendern or edit as ntsc on ntsc and then ausrendern synonymous if the original file "pal" is
- Lighting design to American standards (which is hardly financially feasible)
- Postproduktion (bleach omit high saturation set bitrate down)
true extent? : D
Antwort von Bernd E.:
postproduktion (bleach omit high saturation set bitrate down) Since the Bleichbadüberbrückung video material on some difficulties, maybe you can help this next link:
www.kamera-board.de/wbb2/thread.php?postid=346&sid=0f37969c38a3047be1d4be6a825279ee # post346
Gruß Bernd E.
Antwort von beiti:
So ... ntsc-effekt (so we have called) can thus be as follows:
- Ausrendern or edit as ntsc on ntsc and then ausrendern synonymous if the original file "pal" is
- Lighting design to American standards (which is hardly financially feasible)
- Postproduktion (bleach omit high saturation set bitrate down)
true extent? : D You still do not want to acknowledge that there is
nothing to do with NTSC has. I do not know why you're so on the television standard've inserted. You should you prefer to search for a new name - which is difficult, as long as it comes to very different effects goes ( "Seven" is probably different than "Friends").
Have you ever watched television in America? You do not realize that a different standard than at home in Germany.
Antwort von Nicht eingeloggt:
404ERR
Antwort von LH:
holla Waldfee the ... yes this is really hard out ...
have the notion ntsc only made it because we hold not previously know better ... of me I can now synonymous "rauhaardackel" call ... yes no preference is ... 've now understood that there is obviously nothing to do ... and laziness ... naja ... which may well be right ... but when it eh individually because it is not so clear technical approach is ... naja ... then tinker wirs yes anyway as we s.besten like ... and when we have the principle of "rauhaardackel";) like ... then we can quietly go into the direction: D
you gave us, in any case very helpful ... vielen dank auf jeden fall ever ... and we have certainly soon again ne stupid question ... then you can re ne round nasty to us;)
gruss and thank
francesco and jan
